Modification Recommendations
- Thread starter EP3 Dave
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Thats great Ill have to get saving thats my target!Cheers guys
How much am I looking at for water/methanol injection? and where would you recommend trying to find?
You're probably looking at £300 for a AEM complete kit, then get it mapped with Kpro/K100 big power gains out of water and alcohol between 10 to15% with good set-up/tune, I think it's well worth it IMO! Imagine hot summer days, no loss in power when driving the car hard!
My set up will be a full race progressive Aquamist methanol kit so not cheap at all!
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Ah right thats cool what gains in bhp do you think id be looking at for the £300 job? and it doesn't sound cheap but I bet it will be amazing! Whats your car running bhp wise at the moment?
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How much are you looking to spend and are you going to be using the car on track at all?
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I can't give you exact WHP/Wheel Torque figures but for sure you will make decent power in a N/A set-up as you'll be able to run a lot of advance ignition timing! water/meth injection reduces a lot of heat in the exhaust system and intake and all your internal parts of the engine stay shiny clean,pistons,head, valves, intake manifold and no carbon build up, less contamination to the oil ect,clean combustion, lower emissions! Even more power from a boosted set-up!
I have not dyno'd my car yet but soon will do when the rotrex stage 2 goes in a few months time!! Water injection IMO is the way to go when it comes to make easy power/ torque without stressing the engine too much and super efficiency!
Unfortunately to make some decent ponies out of a K20 will cost quite a bit, I just try not think about cost at all but a well set-up car, at least that's my main goal with my EP3R!
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No.
He's not turbo charged or supercharged for a start.
While you can run water injection on some N/A applications it is not advised on the K20, and with stage one bolt on modifications it is completely pointless.
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Why not dotty?
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I have nothing constructive to add, in view of DOOOOOOOKS, I shall refrain from breaking you.
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Water/meth injection is pointless on an NA setup because you don't run high enough intake temps.
Typically you get anything between 0C and 10C above ambient temperature depending which intake you have. You can get higher obviously if you have a shocker of an intake. You can add all the ignition timing you want (within reason) at those temps.
Water/meth only becomes any use on boosted applications where intake temps can get as high as 60-80C depending on which charger you have and whether you use an intercooler or charge cooler. At those temps, yes you are restricted to the ignition advance you can use before it starts knocking. Even then, water/meth is the thin end of the wedge.
Basically water/meth on a normal NA build is unnecessary.
Typically you get anything between 0C and 10C above ambient temperature depending which intake you have. You can get higher obviously if you have a shocker of an intake. You can add all the ignition timing you want (within reason) at those temps.
Water/meth only becomes any use on boosted applications where intake temps can get as high as 60-80C depending on which charger you have and whether you use an intercooler or charge cooler. At those temps, yes you are restricted to the ignition advance you can use before it starts knocking. Even then, water/meth is the thin end of the wedge.
Basically water/meth on a normal NA build is unnecessary.
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That.
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On the subject of water injection my Evo 6 had it installed. It was the aquamist kit and it was activated when the intercooler spray button was pressed. It also had a small leak on its reservoir which used to annoy me (not that i used it). The install was messy too and I was actually thinking about removing it before I sold it.
You can see the blue piping for it here.
You can see the blue piping for it here.
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Loxy on my set-up I will be using a top mount intercooler so for sure my intake charge will be higher than a front mount one don't you think?
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On the subject of water injection my Evo 6 had it installed. It was the aquamist kit and it was activated when the intercooler spray button was pressed. It also had a small leak on its reservoir which used to annoy me (not that i used it). The install was messy too and I was actually thinking about removing it before I sold it.
You can see the blue piping for it here.
dotty my system number1 won't be activated by pressing buttons at all oh no!! That's old tech mate not being funny!
Mine will be controlled by Kpro, I've never experienced any leaks!
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Yes.
Seems a very very odd place to put it when you have the option of behind the front bumper. Even with the scoop, you'll get nowhere near as much airflow over the intercooler compared to the bumper option, plus it will be sat in the engine bay, just above the rocker cover and with the radiated heat from the gearbox and exhaust manifold.
Seems like on bordering on a lunatic idea if you ask me. You'd get better results from a front mounted intercooler. It's not like you're saving lag by shortening the pipework, it's a Rotrex not a turbo.
That's your car though, it's up to you.
Water/meth on an NA car is still pointless though.
What Dotty meant, I think, and what I meant by it being the thin end of the wedge, was that you have the car mapped with the injection all running fine, then some time down the line you get a leak, failure or whatever, the map is still going to be forcing a load of ignition in and the car will be knocking itself into oblivion.
I'm not saying it doesn't work on a boosted car, it does. Lots of people have run it, loved it and not had issues. Others haven't been so lucky.
Personally I'd just get the bottom mount Rotrex kit and fit the bigger charger. No need to be messing about with injection, and you'd have a healthier slab of torque from the bigger charger.
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Loxy that's a 14.7 psi charger,intercooler designed by TTS performance , and made 350whp without water/meth and scoop fitted by Richard no lag as pipe work is very short.That kit was put through its paces with good results.My oil cooler and rotrex oil cooler will be behind the bumper and no where else!!! Manifold will be shielded from as much heat as possible!! The car will be running dual maps, my system will check for leak and pressure loss and will only inject at a preset boost pressure. If water level is low, pressure loss, a leak is detected system will shutdown. I don't have to run meth all the time as I can turn it on or off at the touch of a button from the gauge. I'm running C30-94 charger which IMO is big enough for a stock K20a2 engine!
Bottom mounted charger brackets can fail as they're constantly under attack from road salts, water ect. To dottys heads up, thanks for the advice bro, but I know what can go wrong with water/ meth and this isn't my first time using it!
Using water meth in N/A form in this country is pointless as gains will be quite small, but from a very hot climate where intake charge is quite high and where I come from it ain't, trust me!! Have you ever used/ experienced water / meth?! Nos and meth have different chemical compositions but both reduce intake charge, nitrous will freeze the intake charge like as if you were in the North Pole
), water is sprayed in a very fine mist under a lot of pressure(different jet sizes) and as it atomizes it takes a lot of heat away and you're left with more oxygen/fuel to burn. The meth acts like extra cool fuel and also as an octane booster just like race fuel to supress detonation and good intake cooler!I know a front mount intercooler has a better flow from a aerodynamic point of view but I'm compromised to having to run a top mount intercooler!Hopefully my Gruppe M will help keeping intake charges low! I like to experiment with different ideas and why not? If it works than great if not I then you keep on trying to make it work and never give up! In a crash intercooler won't get damaged so some added protection there. Animals, debris can also be swallowed by the intercooler. It's worse to run without intercooler. I'm a huge Subaru fan and Subarus from factory used to have top mount intercoolers with water spray as in rally stages mud and stuff make the intercooler inefficient if mounted behind the bumper. I can also run a similar system right? I want to have a different set-up from the rest and a touch of Scooby won't hurt that much!! I will share with you guys all the goods and bads of running this type of set-up and appreciate all types of criticism so thanks for that guys!!