Vitka's left hand drive NHB EP3

[Chris.]

Great work!

 

[Vitka]

This is how the exhaust valves looked after disassembling the head. This is why you don't mix up the valve stem seals

Some random pictures of the cylinder head being worked on
278449320_256445906627696_8984559577066833485_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278527575_517901126651083_445294029553900075_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278243619_3177214339185603_5353972136396444641_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278257811_1727876154216463_1878542250785579142_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278297086_313451794231562_1795424093352245643_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278653813_507851237501971_8524939409782100016_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278464458_513620836917486_6182690401779624500_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278491891_1033720010874731_8292708248955963980_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
278385992_1444934869313312_2209036707370423899_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr

 

[Vitka]

The 1000 km running in period had been done a few days ago, this is how the oil looked like at the end. Hardly a drop was missing, so I think we did a good job.
2022-05-16_09-57-58 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
I still need to do the valve clearances, set them up to be the tightest according to the service manual for max power, but I gave her the full beans a few times, she's as powerful as ever, and the engine is still in one piece, so I am very happy. The oil I chose to run the car with is Motul 8100 X-Clean 5W40, a bit on the expensive side, but it should hold up nicely on the road and on the few track days I plan to run every year.

 

[Shoonk]

Glad all is ok with it.

Sent from my LG-M200 using Tapatalk

 

[Vitka]

An issue I found after putting the engine back together was an oil leak. The guy who did the cylinder head put the VTEC valve gasket back in the wrong way, or maybe the gasket failed, so I put in a new one and the leak was gone. I had to do this before the first track day of the year.

1655400258149 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr

I hadn't booked a place for this particular trackday, but so many people prepayed and missed out, that the occasion had quite a few spots freed up, so I thought I'd give it a go. It is a very tiny track called M-ring, it's quite new. I was sixth in the FWD category, and everything ahead of me was either a seriously modified car, or something 5 times the value. NS2Rs held up ok, but I think I will need to look into even stickier tyres. Possibly not full slicks, becasue then I would have to polibush the entire car, and I don't really want to do that, because I still run her more on the streets. I'm thinking a second set of wheels, and a set of Nankang AR1 semi slicks, or maybe Toyo R888s, we will see. A suspension upgrade is still planned, it's just a metter of when. Anyway, we enjoyed the day a lot, great crew, great cars

1655400258134 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr

Another upgrade I will probably do is an oil cooler kit along with an oil temp gauge. We did the MOT today, so we're good for another 2 years :) I have no oil temperature gauge, but the guy, who did the MOT told me, that his machine showed 113 celsius for the oil, which is quite high, considering I was stuck behind a bus for 10 km before I reached the place, and the car was only idling for a few minutes. Of course, I don't know the exact reading, it was just a machine, that got the data from wherever, but I always thought K20s ran a bit hot, so an oil cooler should be a good idea. The high temps would explain the oil comsumption I had on track, and driving to and from the track on the motorway. It wasn't much, but during the running in period it was close to 0, so I'm concerned a bit. Track use and hard road use in the summer might overstep the limits of 5W40, so I am thinking about going 5W50, but if I put in an oil cooler, 5W40 should be just perfect.

In the end, with the MOT done, the engine done, and a trackday behind me, I am feeling really really good about the Civic. I've done many things I could only plan for a long while, because life happened. But her being in top condition now, and having gotten the best job opportunity a few days ago, that I've ever had by a mile, I think things are finally making a turn for the better, after almost 3 years in the ditch. Yes, I know I'm getting sentimental, but it's been a long time coming for these words. Full of smiles, full of plans, I'd like to continue now in the way I began before the hard times hit.

 

[Vitka]

Best pic from the trackday. We had a brief shower, and I thought I'd slide around a bit in the wet, it is great fun!
285457902_10159816438633905_2454055833210059466_n by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr

 

[Chris.]

Nice updates. Oil coolers should only be necessary on boosted cars, otherwise they can keep the oil too cool.

 

[Vitka]

Nice updates. Oil coolers should only be necessary on boosted cars, otherwise they can keep the oil too cool.

Yeah, after doing some reading, I found out, that the oil should not be too cool either, because sulfur and other contaminants will not burn away, and water will have an easier time staying in the engine as well, so an oil temp of 100 C is recommended as minimum. Otherwise, the oil will build up acidity and that can cause excess wear on the engine. This is where the old wisdom comes in, that I would rather buy a car with 150k motorway miles, than one with 50k city miles. It just bothers me, that after the engine refurb, and next to no consumption on the road, I am still losing a bit of oil on the track. Yes, I know, that VTEC engines do like to burn away some oil at full beans, and maybe it should be like this, but I really do have PTSD about oil consumption And this was only a tiny track, I don't know what will happen, when I take her to the Hungaroring for a few 20 minute stints in the middle of the summer.

I'm sure I'm overreacting a bit, but next year I will probably try out Mobil's Rally Formula 5W50, just to see how it holds up.

 

[kinky_boy]

@Vitka - you know the saying: Honda doesn't burn the oil, it is using it! ... i wouldn't worry about this if it is in marginal quantities, mine is getting like 1l in 10k km, which is even better because along the year period i'm refilling with fresh oil keeping the oil quality always good

 

[Vitka]

I thought I'd share a few photos of the car and myself, that were taken on the 2nd of september on the track called Kakucsring.
TV_06430 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
TV_06418 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
TV_05970 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
TV_05940 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08940 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08906 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08880 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08877 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08610 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08572 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
KG_08355 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
I need to lose a lot more weight
KG_08322 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr
DJI_0411 by Gergő Vitányi, on Flickr

 

[Vitka]

@Vitka - you know the saying: Honda doesn't burn the oil, it is using it! ... i wouldn't worry about this if it is in marginal quantities, mine is getting like 1l in 10k km, which is even better because along the year period i'm refilling with fresh oil keeping the oil quality always good

Mine burned 1l in 500 kilometers before the engine refurb. Oil consumption depends largely on the way the car is used, of course. And as I found, K20s don't like ester and poliol based oils.

 

[Vitka]

I didn't post anything in 2023? Wow. Just to not let my thread die, I thought I'd post something. The Civic is doing ok, but has been garage-bound since last autumn. MOT expired, and there are a few things I need to get it back on the road, which are the following: a pair of tyres, a set of brake pads in the front (considering going above Yellowstuff, because I cooked them a few times), and 1 or 2 engine mounts. Other than that she's is in very good shape. I couldn't do these this year, because we renovated the kitchen, then I started saving money for the newest member of the fleet, a Triumph Tiger 1200, who joined the garage in june. Since then I handed in my resignation, and it turned out, that my current employer screwed up, when they calculated my fuel money for commuting, so I owe them almost 1,5 months of salary So now I need to save money for that, which means the Civic will spend the rest of the year in the garage. Pity, but it is what it is. As soon as I'm done with changing jobs, I can get her back into focus :)

She spent a single night outside this year, of course, exactly when the sahara sand came.

 

[Chris.]

Ah that's a shame, I'm sure she'll be back on the road and track soon enough!

 

[Vitka]

Been a while... happy to say, that she now has everything I mentioned in my latest comment above. She has new tyres on the front, I put on new brake calipers on the rear, and although I bought a front and rear engine mount, it turned out they weren't needed. The bolt of the front mount came a bit loose and it sounded like it was gone, but no, all good. New brake fluid as well and Yellowstuff pads, plus I have a set of Bluestuff pads for the front, when the current ones wear out. MOT will be done on the 19th, as I checked everything is in order, so I'm calm as can be. That's all there is to say for now, still in very good shape, still a joy to drive.

Finally, I can't believe I am saying this, but most likely this is our last full year together. I still need to get to terms with this, because I love this car, so it will be a tough goodbye. The reason is, that after 6 years of ownership, I have set eyes on my next hobby car.

 

[Chris.]

Shame, what do you have your eyes on?

 

[Vitka]

Shame, what do you have your eyes on?

It really is a shame, I had so many plans still. LSD, set of springs, getting her dyno tuned, camber arms and bolts etc. Also, trying some semi slicks on the track, taking her on other tracks nearby, for example the Hungaroring, Slovakiaring, or the newest one the Balaton Park Ring. And my biggest regret of all is, that I never made it to the UK to meet you guys. I read in another topic about car meets planned, but I never made it. Pity.

To answer your question, I decided to commit automotive and financial suicide next year. I plan on importing an RX7 FD from Japan.

 

[Vitka]

And this was only a tiny track, I don't know what will happen, when I take her to the Hungaroring for a few 20 minute stints in the middle of the summer.

I'm sure I'm overreacting a bit, but next year I will probably try out Mobil's Rally Formula 5W50, just to see how it holds up

I managed to learn the answer to this question by accident a couple of days ago. I have a friend, huge Honda guy, owns a 2006 Accord TypeS and a tuned mark 4 Prelude built by himself. We talk a lot about cars and when I mentioned the new oil I am trying out (Valvoline VR1 Racing 5W-50, works well), we talked about the differences of the K20 and K24. The K24 has a heat exchanger at the oil filter, which the K20 doesn't have, plus the revs and horsepower per liter are higher on a K20, so it will obviously run hotter. So hot in fact, that when a guy my friend knows took their EP3 to the Hungaroring with 5W30 oil, he shot the bearings. He went home from that trackday with some serious engine knock and had to do a full rebuild. Yikes.

So a piece of advice to any newbie K20 owners and the future owner of my car. If you drive her hard a lot and/or the ambient temps are hot:
PAY ATTENTION TO THE OIL!!!!!

I'll list a few oils below, that I tried and worked well:

Liqui Moly Toptec 4100 5w40 - semi synthetic, works well even with spirited use.
Valvoline Max Life 5w40 - full synthetic, held up really well! Designed for high milage engines with wear. Considering K20 factory tolerances, I can see why
Total 9000 5w40 - disliked by some, regarded as "cheap". On the contrary, very good oil. My mate used it in a B18C even. For normal daily driving, it will hold up really well, even with some spirited runs every now and then.
Mobil Rally Formula 5w50 - fully synthetic oil for hard use. Held up ok, average consumption, but in reality it wasn't better, than the 2 semi synthetic ones, or not by much.
Valvoline VR1 Racing 5w50 - semi synthetic racing oil. Interesting to see semi synthetic pushed to 5w50, but I guess Valvoline had done their job. Have been using it for a couple of weeks now, and holds up really well.

My experience with the K20 engine is the following: it does run quite hot. When you drive carefully, there is no issue with the temps and oil, but if you start doing any kind of pace or go on the freeway, it will immediately catapult the oil temps in the 115-120 celsius range easy. The "problem" is, that the K20A2 is now a 24 year old design. Additionally all the tolerances were designed to be quite loose, to be able to cope with the 8250 redline and the heat the engine produces. This means, that most modern oils just can't keep up. The problem with most modern common oils, even if they are 5W40 is, that they thin out a lot under high temps. From 5w40 in a flatout K20, we end up with 0w20 basically, or lower. I remember how excited I was to try out the Motul 5w40 X-clean... NO, just NO.

When a buddy of mine brought his EP3 to a track day with 10w60 in it, I thought he went crazy and will go home with rod knock. Turns out, he was right all along. I never dared to put anything thicker, than 5w in mine, but I can agree with what he did.

All in all, I can only quote the big'ol truths told by many before me about the K20. Always mind the oil, check the level after every tank of gas if you drive it hard, especially in the summer. Stay away from common, modern 5w40s, the oils listed above worked well for me. But, no matter what you put in it, if you drive the car hard, it will always have oil consumption. To be fair, as I mentioned this some time ago, a small oil cooler with a ~110 degrees C thermostat might be a good idea.

 

[Chris.]

I never had any issues with Petronas 10w60 over all the track days I did in my FD5 and FD2. I think TGM in Fleet also used another brand, perhaps Mobil 1. Another track person who now races also uses Petronas IIRC.

 

[Vitka]

I never had any issues with Petronas 10w60 over all the track days I did in my FD5 and FD2. I think TGM in Fleet also used another brand, perhaps Mobil 1. Another track person who now races also uses Petronas IIRC.

If she stayed for longer, maybe I would've given it a try, but a Honda dealership mechanic once told me to NEVER go above 5w. And there is also some general knowledge about thicker oil never being the solution, I feared for the rod bearings.